I also really enjoy John Ringo, even if I don’t always agree with a particular point he is making. But I haven’t gotten around to the Ghost series yet. After your comments, I am more inclined to give it a try just to see what all the fuss is about :).

I also pretty much devour anything by David Weber. I attended DragonCon in Atlanta this past year where he was on several panels. The one I caught was on women heroes in fiction. Of the 6 or so great authors. David Weber was the only guy.

Have you read the Belisarius series by Eric Flint and David Drake?
Here is a link to someone’s Amazon listmania for it:
http://www.amazon.com/Belisarius-Novels-Flint-David-Drake/lm/1LNG8VZ592DWT/ref=cm_lmt_dtpa_f_1_rdssss0?pf_rd_p=253462201&pf_rd_s=listmania-center&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B000MKYKDQ&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0P8AB8W61TYYF3TBPQKF

But I did read it this time… and I’d have to say, he is spot on. The horrible, disturbing, WTF stuff in the first book is why seeing someone else make a “OH JOHN RINGO NO!” shirt made me laugh so much. Because it’s just so absolutely true.

I’m actually re-reading the series right now, and I still can’t stop myself from skimming past the dark and evil parts that I know to avoid.

The thing that’s really funny? I read the books in the wrong order also, just like the reviewer. And that’s the only reason I read on.

I had bought and read all the Prince Roger books, and the Posleen books, but I’d never heard of the Ghost series before last summer.

I don’t go into bookstores much… okay, ever. Not unless I am physically looking for something that I don’t want to wait on Amazon to ship to me, or unless I’m looking for cheap used books in an out-of-print series in a used bookstore.

So I don’t browse shelves… I browse the public library.

It may shock you to know that, in my county library, they do NOT stock the Ghost series in the Science Fiction department. Just because most of the rest of what he writes belongs in fantasy/sci fi, that is where I would expect to see his books. And I don’t make a habit of browsing other shelves but sci/fi and mystery and detective stories. And the graphic novel/comic books. And the political and history sections, sadly. /shallow.

But I did a library search one time to see when the latest Prince Roger book was going to be available to reserve a harcover, and searched under his name… and this list of OTHER books by him popped out.

WTF?

Yes, my public library had all of them… every single one. Some books were at one library in the network, some were at others. but I requested them all, and noted that book 2 was in my local library on the shelf. So I drove over and grabbed it.

And being the way I am, instead of waiting for book 1 to read them in proper order, I read what I had… and while there were some WTF moments in it, I moved on past ‘em and enjoyed the over the top action. Seriously, it’s the completely over-the-top ‘oh you’ve got to be kidding me are you insane I know he didn’t just do that’ nature of the books that made me enjoy them. It’s like Mack bolan and Remo Williams on steroids for wish fulfillment, and it’s fascinating. And having read Ringo’s other books, I knew darned well taht it wasn’t an accident by a first time writer… he had to have meant to be that crazy, and done it intentionally. Almost as if he wanted to write a book that made people freak out. Oh John Ringo, NO!

So it was after being hooked on the second book that I then got book 3, and read it, and marveled at the WTF scenes, and the way he kept the style up, so to speak… and then the library system came up with the first book.

So yeah… the first book is a horror. Seriously, it is a run from the room screaming “OH JOHN RINGO NO!” horror. More and more often as the book goes on, too.

But… at the same time, I knew where it was going to end up, with books 2 and 3, so I skimmed the creepy bits and focused on chasing nukes and killing tangoes. And marveling at how he was able to say all this in his book, and still not be hunted down and murdered by a mob the first time he appeared in public.

Love him or hate him, you’ve got to admire the sheer guts of a man that would publish that book. You people thought I had courage to put out a song with me singing as bad as I do? Hah. I kid you not, I bet he gets death threats.

But something to keep in mind… as bad as Ghost is? Think about this.

My local public government-funded library has every. single. copy. of the Ghost series, in hardcover. Does that not blow you away?

And they are just tucked away on the shelves, without any kind of warning at all. Like ticking little time bombs. No parental advisory label.

Thank God you have to be able to actually read to be corrupted by them.

The other things I see in the library… not so much.

Cassie has heard me rant about this, so now you get to also.

The Kingdom Come DC graphic novel, Watchmen, and The Ultimates marvel graphic novels are on the shelf with the other comic book graphic novels in my public library… right next to Superman and Shazam. And so are others, like Y- The Last Man books 1 through 8 and the powers graphic novels.

I may say “OH JOHN RINGO NO!” and laugh my butt off at the unbelievable over the top craziness in the Ghost books, but at least what I am laughing at is fiction, text, that requires someone to read before they can be offended. And if you get offended? You can stop reading further. You cannot just see sick shit by glancing at an open page.

It still bugs me about the graphic novels, sitting there where teens go browsing for comic books. Ultimates, to me, with the interaction with the Wasp and Hank Pym, for example, or how The Hulk takes care of one of the alien bag guys by eating him is just too mature for me to be comfortable knowing any 9 – 12 year old that’s into comics can see it. Seriously. I’m grateful you ahve them, but please put them somewhere OTHER than in the teen reading area!

Wow this has gotten long. And it’s not like anyone is reading this thread anymore, anyway.

But yeah, I admire someone that speaks their mind and dares the world to break them for it. Even as I would gladly put a bullet in the brain of someone in the real world that did some of the things that the character Mike Harmon did in the last part of the first book.

John feels it is a fair review too..

http://hradzka.livejournal.com/194753.html

Have you seen the review/article that started the whole “Oh John Ringo, No!” meme? It was great.

Have to agree that GURPS was a fun system to make characters with and had stunning worldbooks which were useful whether or not you were going to actually use GURPS to game. My favorite sourcebooks were GURPS Illuminati and GURPS IOU (Illuminati University), which were both very thought provoking (in a world creation sense) and only tangentially related.

On John Ringo: his uebermensch don’t bug me much initially, but they have this annoying habit of turning into nothing more than caricatures of badassery. In the Posleen War series, Bun Bun’s crew was a great group of people as much because they were a relief from the returning characters as because they actually came across as normal people in extraordinary circumstances.

On a side note, check out the Matador series by Steve Perry for something similiar to Ringo but with a martial arts bend to it.

Hymn before battle was good, but I do prefer Weber over Ringo.

I am the one who hooked B3 on GURPS. The HERO system is pretty close in concept. But it’s hard to beat GURPS for interchangeability of genres.
I am an old school RPG’er who prefers PnP to MMORPG, mostly because only in PnP games is there actual role-playing. There aren’t too many systems I haven’t played (I started roleplaying literally one year after the release of the original D&D). I love GURPS character generation, but the combat system needs help, D&D’s character generation has gotten better but still is inferior.It’s combat system while unrealistic, is much more playable. I end up playing good old D&D simply because that’s what a lot of people are comfortable with.

As for the Witness’s, sometimes it is good to be big and fairly intimidating. My jewelry usually contains some pagan symbols and I just refer to the worship of a deity of that particular mythos. “What!?! You’ve never experienced the pleasures of a true Bacchanalia? Well, next full moon…” Generally tends to make them go away.

For table top games I can’t find anything better than HERO. It really is the everything system. While the Big Bullet Proof Book might seem intimidating, it is truly awesome. Starting with HERO Sidekick is cheap and gives a good intro into the system. But for background material and genre stuff it’s hard to beat GURPS – Steve Jackson puts an awesome amount of good material in the genre books. I just think HERO is a better gaming framework.