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	<title>Comments on: Ignorant people also suck</title>
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	<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/</link>
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		<title>By: Kirk</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9579</link>
		<dc:creator>Kirk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9579</guid>
		<description>Firing someone...  actually, um.  OK, as I&#039;ve told you privately before, I&#039;ve worked public sector for a long time.  You know, government.  The so-called &quot;gold-plated&quot; jobs that once you&#039;re in you can never be pushed out of.  To which I respond, &quot;Bull.&quot;

I started to write a long post, and instead will keep it a LOT shorter.

1) If your boss will do things by the numbers, and IF FNGE continues this way, it could take as little as a month to get rid of him.  The important thing is your boss&#039;s actions.

2) I agree with Sid, sorta, that you need to respond to the email.  However, don&#039;t do so with an email.  Instead, print the email and write a memo to your boss.  In there you address all the points already mentioned above.  INCLUDE the fact that his behavior caused you additional mental stress having to respond to all these people - list the people if you can recall them all.  Also include the fact that his supercilious attitude and refusal to work with peers (no second/third opinion, remember) is creating a difficult (not hostile) work environment.

With the memo, the boss has a lot more options.  It doesn&#039;t mean the boss will do what&#039;s necessary, but it does give more options - to include, if the FNGE doesn&#039;t shape up - the ability to get rid of him.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Firing someone&#8230;  actually, um.  OK, as I&#8217;ve told you privately before, I&#8217;ve worked public sector for a long time.  You know, government.  The so-called &#8220;gold-plated&#8221; jobs that once you&#8217;re in you can never be pushed out of.  To which I respond, &#8220;Bull.&#8221;</p>
<p>I started to write a long post, and instead will keep it a LOT shorter.</p>
<p>1) If your boss will do things by the numbers, and IF FNGE continues this way, it could take as little as a month to get rid of him.  The important thing is your boss&#8217;s actions.</p>
<p>2) I agree with Sid, sorta, that you need to respond to the email.  However, don&#8217;t do so with an email.  Instead, print the email and write a memo to your boss.  In there you address all the points already mentioned above.  INCLUDE the fact that his behavior caused you additional mental stress having to respond to all these people &#8211; list the people if you can recall them all.  Also include the fact that his supercilious attitude and refusal to work with peers (no second/third opinion, remember) is creating a difficult (not hostile) work environment.</p>
<p>With the memo, the boss has a lot more options.  It doesn&#8217;t mean the boss will do what&#8217;s necessary, but it does give more options &#8211; to include, if the FNGE doesn&#8217;t shape up &#8211; the ability to get rid of him.</p>
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		<title>By: minnieu</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9575</link>
		<dc:creator>minnieu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 10:41:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9575</guid>
		<description>Someone needs a hug...


/hug BBB</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone needs a hug&#8230;</p>
<p>/hug BBB</p>
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		<title>By: bigbearbutt</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9574</link>
		<dc:creator>bigbearbutt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 10:01:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9574</guid>
		<description>Just so there is some closure on this issue, the guy came in for second shift last night, and was spoken to for a few minutes by the customer service engineer. Not our boss, the customer service engineer who, as you can imagine was highly torqued. 

I like the phrase &#039;highly torqued&#039;, because it is very accurate. He is put under massive pressure, but the pressure is so carefully measured that it comes just to the point of making him snap, without quite going over that line.

Anyway, the upshot is, in this modern day, in a major corporation, any massive cock-up only results in a strongly (or mildly) written notation to be placed in his file as documentation to build for future possible disciplinary action, and since this was a competence issue, the only time this would actually affect him would be during performance evaluations.

Once you are no longer a temporary, but a full time permanent employee, there is very little that can be done to you based on competence. The things that actually affect your job are attendance and hostility in the workplace. Attitude issues, in other words.

It is easy for them to dismiss someone for attendance violations, since it&#039;s an either/or. Were you hre on time or not?

Firing someone because of a perceived lack of skill or knowledge is much harder, apparently, to defend during a potential lawsuit filed for wrongful termination.

Welcome to modern America.

So, to those of you hoping he will ahve the cost removed from his paycheck, or will be dressed down... I&#039;m sorry, it just doesn&#039;t work that way.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just so there is some closure on this issue, the guy came in for second shift last night, and was spoken to for a few minutes by the customer service engineer. Not our boss, the customer service engineer who, as you can imagine was highly torqued. </p>
<p>I like the phrase &#8216;highly torqued&#8217;, because it is very accurate. He is put under massive pressure, but the pressure is so carefully measured that it comes just to the point of making him snap, without quite going over that line.</p>
<p>Anyway, the upshot is, in this modern day, in a major corporation, any massive cock-up only results in a strongly (or mildly) written notation to be placed in his file as documentation to build for future possible disciplinary action, and since this was a competence issue, the only time this would actually affect him would be during performance evaluations.</p>
<p>Once you are no longer a temporary, but a full time permanent employee, there is very little that can be done to you based on competence. The things that actually affect your job are attendance and hostility in the workplace. Attitude issues, in other words.</p>
<p>It is easy for them to dismiss someone for attendance violations, since it&#8217;s an either/or. Were you hre on time or not?</p>
<p>Firing someone because of a perceived lack of skill or knowledge is much harder, apparently, to defend during a potential lawsuit filed for wrongful termination.</p>
<p>Welcome to modern America.</p>
<p>So, to those of you hoping he will ahve the cost removed from his paycheck, or will be dressed down&#8230; I&#8217;m sorry, it just doesn&#8217;t work that way.</p>
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		<title>By: Mumlock</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9573</link>
		<dc:creator>Mumlock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 08:02:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9573</guid>
		<description>Hey.

I&#039;d like to take this opportunity to tell you how much I admire someone who can openly name his faults and has learnt how to make up for them.
I know (and you would probably admit) that what you wrote is only your point of view, but even reading between the lines I could not find anything which might defend the actions of the individual you used as an _example_.

I feel sorry for what you have/had to go through, but it&#039;s the good guys who get the most bashed on usually (telling from my experience)... Meaning that in this situation you&#039;re the &#039;good guy&#039;.

All in all - cheer up! It&#039;s a beautiful day!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d like to take this opportunity to tell you how much I admire someone who can openly name his faults and has learnt how to make up for them.<br />
I know (and you would probably admit) that what you wrote is only your point of view, but even reading between the lines I could not find anything which might defend the actions of the individual you used as an _example_.</p>
<p>I feel sorry for what you have/had to go through, but it&#8217;s the good guys who get the most bashed on usually (telling from my experience)&#8230; Meaning that in this situation you&#8217;re the &#8216;good guy&#8217;.</p>
<p>All in all &#8211; cheer up! It&#8217;s a beautiful day!</p>
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		<title>By: Nim</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9572</link>
		<dc:creator>Nim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 05:58:49 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;m hooked!  What happened?  I hope the lone ranger gets the proper smack-down and, as you said, they all used the same tone of voice with him (or his boss) as they did with you.  Vindication awaits!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m hooked!  What happened?  I hope the lone ranger gets the proper smack-down and, as you said, they all used the same tone of voice with him (or his boss) as they did with you.  Vindication awaits!</p>
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		<title>By: Mannyac</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9569</link>
		<dc:creator>Mannyac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 22:19:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9569</guid>
		<description>BBB- remember the story about the gunny, the mortar crew and the ex-wife? Maybe he&#039;s available</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BBB- remember the story about the gunny, the mortar crew and the ex-wife? Maybe he&#8217;s available</p>
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		<title>By: Stupid Mage</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9568</link>
		<dc:creator>Stupid Mage</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 21:58:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9568</guid>
		<description>At least you have documented proof that it really wasn&#039;t you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At least you have documented proof that it really wasn&#8217;t you.</p>
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		<title>By: Tess</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9567</link>
		<dc:creator>Tess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 20:46:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9567</guid>
		<description>and always remember
&quot;my momma always told me that Stupid is as Stupid does&quot;
-F.G.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and always remember<br />
&#8220;my momma always told me that Stupid is as Stupid does&#8221;<br />
-F.G.</p>
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		<title>By: Tess</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9566</link>
		<dc:creator>Tess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 20:42:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9566</guid>
		<description>Or, Blind CC the boss/bosses.  I would use this option to keep the bosses in the loop as to what is going to prevent this in the future, and keep the co-worker&#039;s in the mindset that you all  (engineers) will figure out any issues internally.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or, Blind CC the boss/bosses.  I would use this option to keep the bosses in the loop as to what is going to prevent this in the future, and keep the co-worker&#8217;s in the mindset that you all  (engineers) will figure out any issues internally.</p>
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		<title>By: Skarlarth</title>
		<link>http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-9565</link>
		<dc:creator>Skarlarth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Sep 2008 19:24:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thebigbearbutt.com/2008/09/02/ignorant-people-also-suck/#comment-9565</guid>
		<description>BBB I feel for you sir.

As for the reactive e-mail, as it was only sent to the engineering group, I agree with Kestrel, the nuclear retalition may not be needed.

However speaking from experience, when they copy your boss and your boss&#039; boss, a well worded, explicity documented with circles and pointy arrows reply is a great defense and leaves you with a warm glow.  Especially when you sign it off with the Willy Wonka reset &quot;Good day sir.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BBB I feel for you sir.</p>
<p>As for the reactive e-mail, as it was only sent to the engineering group, I agree with Kestrel, the nuclear retalition may not be needed.</p>
<p>However speaking from experience, when they copy your boss and your boss&#8217; boss, a well worded, explicity documented with circles and pointy arrows reply is a great defense and leaves you with a warm glow.  Especially when you sign it off with the Willy Wonka reset &#8220;Good day sir.&#8221;</p>
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