Well, it’s happened.

I can no longer take pride in saying we downed something in Kara.

They nerfed the ever living “Are you KIDDING me?!?” heck out of it.

I’m not saying I dislike it. I’m not crying that it’s now “kiddy kara”.

I’m just saying, at our level of commitment to the game and investment in building our gear, each of the upper bosses was still a challenge, that was certainly doable but required patience, undestanding, skill and effort on everyone’ part.

Yep!

People in Tier 5 and Tier 6 gear are long past the point where they can remember how challenging Karazhan could be for a group with Heroic purples and Crafted/Reputation gear.

Those folks, in their superior gear, were often heard in Trade chat to lol at the lowly players who did not breeze through two hour Karas.. as though the gear was not a factor, it was skill that made the difference.

A true reason to lol, frankly. If they were that great, they would have had their guilds throw on all Heroic purps and Crafted gear and do a two hour Kara run on video. Plenty of peeps still do videos of two manning Onyxia, so you know a guild would’ve done it.

No, it’s just easy to look down on others, for some folks. And the rest of us laughed it off, and took pride in challenging Karazhan while appropriately geared, and kicking it’s butt through a tough fight.

Tonight, we went into Karazhan with our new Talent specs.

We had scheduled it like always, 7 PM to 11:30 PM server.

This time, however, I was curious. I knew that I felt insanely powerful.. and I knew that Blizzard had said they had reduced boss health by 30% across the board.

So, how fast could we go? How far could we progress in that time?

Just how far have we come, when we were a cautious guild that could down every boss reliably, but had trouble on Netherspite and usually passed on him, and usually didn’t bother taking the time to do Illhoof without a Warlock, or Nightbane.

Well, let me put it like this.

We went in at 7:25 server time, and headed for Attumen.

We took a break around 9:30.

We had cleared all of Karazhan, and I mean every single last thing except the Animal boss, by 10:20. Easily. Quickly. No wipes. No stress.

Second guild try EVER on Netherspite, and it went down. Heck, I don’t think our health was even nibbled at.

In fact, the only thing we didn’t do first try, was Chess. There is some kind of bug, where if you get your piece dead, you cannot move your body again until you click off a debuff on your buff bar… and if you have a custom UI, you can’t click it off at all. That made us fail first shot, when we didn’t unload on Warchief right out the gate.

It wasn’t simply that the bosses are nerfed. It is that the trash is nerfed, too. Everything, every single thing in Karazhan is nerfed. Not just the bosses.

And let’s be honest. Every single one of us, with new specs carefully planned out, has become a walking powerhouse.

It was insane.

At 10:20, with an hour and ten minutes left for our normally scheduled time, we decided to keep going. And we went to UBRS and did the 50 Whelps, so all of us are now “Jenkins”.

Then, what the hell… we all went to Onyxia’s Lair and killed a Dragon.

And all done by 11:30.

This is not a complaint.

I was feeling pretty good in there. We worked hard for a long time. We had the skill, we had the knowledge from study and practise, we had done it all before. But each time, new alts would come in, and our gear never progressed beyond Karazhan. So each time in, the challenge level had remained the same, with the extra fun of always having to explain the fights for the benefit of those that had not seen it before.

Suddenly, it was as though we had finally been given that feeling that Tier 6 raiders have long known… the joys of fighting something you know very, very well… with the power to hand it a serious beating… but without making it a 3 man snoozefest.

We still needed the heals, we still needed the godlike DPS, Netherspite still has every game mechanic.

But now, we had the tools you get when you are coming back down from riding high on the back of a dragon, chasing raid loot, and decide to stop off at a low-level village filled with Kobokds, trying out your Great Cleave feat.

It felt pretty fun. We did lots of fun, silly stuff on the run, and had a great time.

The loot is all rebooted in a month anyway. Who cares if guilds can suddenly spend four weeks doing massive full clears of stuff that had them on the ropes before? Who does it hurt? How does my getting faster epics of Karazhan power hurt anyone, exactly?

The fact is… the gear is still enough of an upgrade for some folks to make it worthwhile in terms of loot to keep going in, but for most of us… heck, I am on my third character in Kara, and I’m flat out of gear upgrades to look for. I keep going in, because these folks are so much damn fun to play with.

With the stress of having to explain anything gone, worry about time gone, stress over an afk gone… knowing that hell, we CAN be done long before folks get tired…

Just awesome.

But it’s a fact that needs to be said.

I can’t come on this blog and say, “Oh wow we are so leet, we killed Netherspite tonight!”

“Yeah”, comes the reply, “So did our level 65 grannies in greens, noob. L2P.”

What I can say, however, is “Oh wow, we had a TON of fun, clearing all of Kara in three hours, and that was playing at a fun, relaxed pace, not playing like frenzied cokeheads.”

Next up on Tuesday is Zul’Aman. I hesitate to imagine what that is going to be like.

Oh, and a roll call of honor…

We had on tonight’s run;

  • Morthog the pally tank
  • Elysse the feral drood (sometimes off tank, mostly kitty from hell)
  • Doodlebug the resto drood
  • Barrhona the pally healer (and occasional Smite’r)
  • Cassieann the shredder ninja rogue
  • Falromord the Titans Grip fury warrior (and hateful bolt eater)
  • Xiliah the Shadow Priest
  • Elystia the some-kind-of-blasty-spec Mage
  • Felsprite the affliction warlock
  • Windstar the BM hunter type person

That’s right… two healers, one of which spent half the time blasting stuff, and tons of DPS.

In fact, Doodlebug told us he spent some of the time doing “TreePS”.

You want a fast fight, bring LOTS of DPS, the trash go down in an eyeblink. You need to have DPS that can act FAST.

Oh, and Elysse did a great job of swiping Imps on Illhoof. I knew she would.

23 Responses to “Full Kara clear say wut?”
  1. Jemhadar says:

    Went in Kara 7:10pm and left after 1 hour and 50min with breaks, no wipe, 3 deaths because people became crazy and pulled before tanks ;), 12 shards, first time ever in my group doing illhoff without a warlock (double-bear-swipe ftw).
    Gruul only came to growth 4 with me maintanking it for the first time, lol.

    FUN :D

  2. Itok says:

    Ha, sounds like we had the same sort of night. I had not tanked since i loaded the patch. Went in with my buffs and my Health over 20K, was dodging most of the attacks. Or healers were very bored in regards to actual healing. It was only when we were trying to push our limits that they had to heal. I love my new Bear, lots of swipes and I am holding most aggro. However it still took me three times of charging before i learned turn and growl then go back to mangle swipe etc.

    My guild was able to clear Kara as well in about 3 hours as well. We are planning on taking on ZA on Sunday so i hope it goes as well as Kara did. However we will be bringing all of our A team to that one just in case.

    Have a great weekend bro.

    Itok

  3. Beathooven says:

    If it’s anything like what happened to our guild expect the following for your planned ZA run:
    Lag
    Bugs
    Emergency reset
    1 hour downtime
    Login problems
    World server down
    Unannounced server down

    Lag

    It’s true, if you look at the “scheduled emergency server reset/fixes/ohwtf” over the last week, Aman’Thul has often been the top of the list.
    I guess it was the second night normally dedicated to Kara, but still, expecting to pewpewpewpew (double the pewpew), and instead having to play a lowly 14 alt is kind of disappointing.

    Negative note aside, yes, you’re right, it’s awesome. It makes you feel completely and utterly broken.

  4. draiggoch says:

    Damn .. you stole my thunder!

    Was going to write a similar blog after our guild did exactly the same thing last night.

    Nerfed, yes, but awesome fun – especially for a couple of ‘new’ level 70s who’d not been before and came out as proud as punch with their first Kara epics.

    Will just drop a note on my blog later and link it across here. Great post

    draigg

  5. joggoms says:

    You had FUN raiding? Don’t let Blizzard hear you. Raiding is serious business! :)

  6. Eberron says:

    Things have charged, absolutely, and we’re more potent then we were before. I’m not sure that everything is nerfed in to oblivion so much as you’re that much more potent. I’m of the opinion that this is a good thing, as I like being potent. This changes due to the way tanks are doing more damage, for example, means baddies will go down faster.

    From what I’ve read things have changed to make certain classes not an absolute necessity. If you don’t have priests for Shackle, my understanding is you’re supposed to be able to be able to make do (supertanks!) so when you DO show up with your usual Kara brigade which had all these potential issues accounted for you absolutely destroy the encounter. Put this in perspective of, back to Moroes, no priests or pallies with a group consisting primarily of (say) warriors and shaman. That group is supposed to be able to do Moroes.

    On the other hand, you’re just as likely to be flat-out right. We’re all big fish in a quickly growing (frozen) pond.

    If that is so, time to do what I’m setting out to do after coming back to PVE content: Grab a guild, find another 5-10 players from a guild you guys have run some heroics with and do push like a mofo until Illidan’s slowly steaming carcass rots beneath your bear paws.

    Alright, lets do this!

  7. Eberron says:

    Ugh. Wrong words/typos galore up there. Oh well, you should be able to figure my basic point. :)

  8. Eruan says:

    Sounds like you had a great time. Me and 4 other guildies tried 5-manning Kara. Did Attunemen, Mores, Maiden, Wizard of Oz, Nightbane (yeah, Nightbane), and Curator. We called it night cause it was late. All bosses were one-shotted. Ran with Pally tank, Druid OT (me), Priest (healing), Priest (shadow), and Warlock. We all a mix of T4/ZA/Badge/T5 loot. We weren’t going particularly fast, but had a great time.

    As for ZA, our “A” team full cleared ZA for the first time after the patch. I missed it, but seems like the removal of the bear boss was justified.

    Oh, and who doesn’t like Cat Charge? When my guildies saw that for the first time, quite a few ooooo’s and ahhhh’s. Fun stuff.

  9. Artorin says:

    I think of this transition period as the last week of highschool as a senior. You’ve been working hard learning everything and then that last week comes and everyone just wants to have fun! Your smarter stronger and all the old stuff is just cake now. Of course in less then a month we are all going to be going to college and will be working our butts off again. But till that time have fun relax and enjoy the game!

    I’m going into Kara tonight on my priest for the second time ever (first since the patch) and really look foward to having fun. This is my 4th 70 they have all been through Kara my druid especially since july of 07. All the work he went though back then? Who cares? Its party time!!!!

  10. Shrinn says:

    “Not playing like frenzied cokeheads” LUV IT!!!!!!!! Part of the reason I joined the Devils is that sentiment. That whole train of thought FTW :)

    Unfortunatly, the boss has me on the schedule for Tuesday night. I know, it sux! IF I could get my schedule before a Friday of the prior week, I would be able to give you a better heads up >.<
    Now I’m going to go take myself off the list in guild portal. *sob*

  11. Shinano says:

    I share your joy, BB. Maiden down in 33 seconds with a group of alts in the raid was a thing of joy to behold. :)

  12. ARA says:

    Yeah party time in wow. Time to see all the loot & bosses that were out of reach. I’m also really concentrating on playing with friends in or out of guild, now that class & gear doesnt matter. I can see why guilds shake up around expansions too, for that reason. Its been so much fun not to require eg a pally tank for ZA. I had gotten depressed recently playing with ppl I dont like (because they’re nooby) in my hardcore guild, so that’s all over.

    Oh man, you guys should plan on clearing ZA next time you go . It is a lot of fun & very easy. Just read up on the bosses you havent done… but I dont think you’ll have issues. Do you have enought ppl for 25 mans? You should plan on those too- you guys will have no issues apart from learning the content. I’m sure you could also kill bosses in MH & BT at your current gear levels.

    One other new trick last night: a lot of bear fights now are infinite rage. And with the glyph of maul hitting 2 targets, I decided to macro a /cast Maul into every one of my bear attacks. The results were amazing. Maul did over 50% of my entire damage while AOE tanking and I was never short of rage – nor did I ever click the maul button.

    An example for mangle:
    #showtooltip
    /Cast Mangle-Bear(Rank3)
    /Cast Maul(Rank8)

    Replace your normal mangle with this macro instead. (If the macro can be improved plz let me know)

  13. Xylch says:

    To get rid of that Chess “buff” with a custom UI type: /cancelaura Control Piece

    Also, you should try ZA, it is just as easy as Kara now, my guild is a bit more geared than you guys, but we got all 4 chests with 20 minutes left on the timer (and that is with an accidental wipe on eagle boss, one of our guys got locked out, and the storm spawned on him ftl), and if we did it that fast, I am 100% sure you guys can clear the place.

    When you get to hex lord, have your MT on the boss, OT on all the adds, kill the adds first (don’t CC them, makes it harder), and make sure that everyone is stacked and provided you have a resto druid, just have em spam Wild Growth thru the spirit bolts.

  14. Morgain says:

    I couldn’t believe how easy it all became. We did a ZA run and were at the Eagle Boss within 5 minutes. We killed Lynx with 24 minutes to spare.
    And then Kara… We had my bear tanking and a warrior in all greens offtanking. Not that the warrior needed to tank much. Netherspite went down in 59 seconds. He didn’t even MAKE it to a banish phase. Curator in 1 min 4 seconds, didn’t get an evocate. I was stunned. My little bear was spiking at 3k TPS on Curator. Prepatch I was sitting at about 1k TPS. I’m a little scared to see what happens when I next get into Hyjal.

  15. brian says:

    My Big Bear Butt is only up to 64 and I 3-manned BF with a 62 mage and a 61 priest last night. Not just Kara/Heroics nerfed, but apparently all the outland instances. Ridiculously easy. And I’m still in HFP quests from the xp nerf. YAY! =)

  16. Dirz says:

    EoG is having a similar experiance- 3 hour kara clear, than went into ZA tonight for the first time EVER- and cleared it with minimal hassle- took longer to read zul’jin’s abilities than to kill him:)

  17. Brandon says:

    Well had the same experiance in Kara with my guild on the Llane server. We have ran Kara twice a week for about a year now. Netherspite didn’t get the second set of beams the past two nights. Someones was asking when second phase on prince was happening, heh its been over for a few seconds. we ran ZA and did a full clear in 2 hours 20 minutes. we just got to Keal’thas Sunstrider in TK and the instance server crashed so we will have to get him sunday or another day before reset. yeah it is crazy how nerfed things have become but it is nice to finish some of these places befroe the X-pack comes out and we all head off to level eighty.

  18. afoozle says:

    Yeah my guild just went in tonight, for the first time ever I offtanked with my bear rather than taking my geared hunter, my bear still has shitty green gloves and the MT was a guild alt warrior who has never set food in kara either.

    One of the healers was an alt also and our usual MT was on his alt. I gotta say we spanked the living hell out of that place. We 8 manned prince ffs. no wipes, nothing really hard except nubbing romulo and julianne and having to kill them twice (didn’t kill her before she rezzed him).

    Only boss we didn’t down was netherspite and thats because both healers had to log to get some sleep.

    I had so much fun I spent the next hour happily dragging low guild alts through stocks laughing about how awesome swipe is now.

    I love the new tanking mechanics.

  19. Mike says:

    ZA should not take you more than 2 hours since you all know eachother. I found myself leading a pug ZA and people asked me tacs for malacrass and Zuljin. My answer: “kill all adds before malacrass in the designated order” and “mind the tornados and just nuke zul’jin”.

    Not a nice thing to say about the final 2 Badass bosses of ZA which used to make us go to bed mad.

    We were doing Kara with 2 healers and 2 tanks before (and made it once with 2 healers and 1 tank). Gonna try and tank it solo and have out best shammy as ONLY healer.

  20. Pete says:

    My first time ever in Kara at the weekend: I had the free time (vital!) and I saw “LF OT Kara” in the lfg channel. Went in there in my S2/Heavy Clefthoof/Earthwarden set. Went out again about 3h later with pretty much everything down: Attumen, Moroes, Maiden, Curator, Chess, Prince, Netherspite, etc. I got a pile of loot out of it: Terestrian’s Staff, Moroes’ watch, the T4 head, a big purple caster staff, two lots of caster bracers.

    Half the raid died on Netherspite but the rest got him down. Unfortunately I moved during flame wreath as well, resulting in a full wipe.

    During Aran, Prince and Maiden I was asked to heal, which I did pretty ineptly (using the default raid UI and no healing addons probably makes this quite hard, and it feels like there have been some changes to the druid heal rotation).

    Not sure of the gear level but a few people I did inspect had blues/heroics gear on. It was a full PUG, no two characters from the same guild, although some of the people there gave the impression of knowing one another.

    While that was stupidly easy for the most part, I also did heroic blood furnace. We tried without CC to start with and I got one-shotted – having 16k armour seems to be a bad nerf. Made up for it by using my new indoor thorns :)

  21. Mitch says:

    I really don’t want to do Kara anymore, but if we were able to clear in under three hours with nine people (my feral butt solo tanking) I almost want to go in just to see how quickly we can do it now.

    I was doing Strat over the weekend to help a pally get water and it felt so awesome to swipe-destroy.

  22. This weekend, we went into kara with a pug. Friday night, my girlfriend and I hit 70 on our rerolls – prot pally and resto shaman. We’d been mostly instancing to level so our gear is decent and I was all blues, 490 def, and about 10.5k health unbuffed. The guy setting up the raid made leader when we got inside and when I looked at the list, I asked the two pallies – “prot?” and the reply was “ret”. I was the only tank. Solo tanking a kara less than 24 hours after hitting 70??!! I looked at everyone else in the raid… There’s no other healers besides my girlfriend??!! Solo healing I guess. And that’s how we rolled. We wiped a couple of times and some died throughout the night. It took us about 4 hours which seems to be an eternity today. But whatever. A few months ago, I’d tried solo healing a kara on my own resto shaman in t6 gear and was unable to because our tank got ripped apart whenever he knocked down. She did it though.

    I can list these as some of my accomplishments: heroic sp, ub, bm at 69 and solo tanking kara. The game is really pretty easy right now but it’s so much damn fun now!!!

  23. Xylarisa says:

    We went into kara on Wednesday with the view that lets have fun, we don’t know what the hell is happening with our new specs, add-ons have crap themselves so lets just have fun. Hit midnight flattened him and were looking for something else to kill it went so fast, didn’t even bother cc’ing moroes just bashed them down, two hours twenty later we were done and decided to take on za for laughs. I dont think one boss in kara went over two minutes and most were under one.

    :)

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