Are you really bored?

About now, most folks have heard that Blizzard’s content developers are designing all new raids in Wrath of the Lich King to be tuned for two different settings; 10 man and 25 man.

The content, we are told, will be mostly the same, the difference in rewards will be that 25 man difficulty will have better loot drops.

I love Karazhan, and the very concept of Karazhan, so I am all in favor of this.

The trick will be in how it is tuned, since Zul’Aman shows that you can tune the difficulty of a 10 man raid so it requires some serious ‘step up’ in order to get it cleared.

I know that, for me, 10 man Karazhan is a lot of fun, primarily because it can be completed in it’s entirety by a solid group of people geared exclusively from PvP, Crafted, BoE, Quest Rewards, Badges and Karazhan drops.

You do not HAVE to have a single person in the raid geared from 25 man content to run Karazhan successfully.

As long as each 10 man version can be completed without requiring gear from 25 man content, it’ll be BRILLIANT.

You can expect that you’ll need to do each one many times before being ready to move on, but hey… that’s the way it works, right?

Enough about that.

My point here, is that we are going to have the opportunity to see all the neat content in 10 man raids, without having to commit to a larger raiding guild, and a lot of people are excited that they won’t be excluded from seeing cool storyline content anymore.

But how many of you that are looking ahead, have taken the opportunity to grasp all that the game has to offer you NOW? 

Let’s be honest, there is a ton of content already existing in the game, content that most current players have not seen. There are a lot of folks that started playing WoW after Burning Crusade was released. And for these players, they have never seen the frenzy of pre-BC raiding or content.

With Wrath of the Lich King months away from release, I keep hearing how players are bored. They want new things to see and do.

Well… does it have to drop shiny new purple upgrades for you to ‘bother’ doing it?

What about doing old school content?

Have you and all your friends cleared BRD? Did you ever escort Marshall Windsor (or the Horde equivalent) and find out why 9 out of 10 Pre-BC players hated BRD for the Ony attunement?

Have you, if you’re Alliance, marched slowly and proudly through Stormwind, escorting Marshall Windsor to face down a certain nefarious lady in Stormwind Keep, and seen what happens when the grand unveiling occurs?

Have you done the quests, cleared Lower Blackrock Spire, and gotten the Ring to unlock Upper Blackrock Spire?

Have you entered Upper Blackrock Spire and killed The Beast? Have you faced down General Drakkisath, completed the Ony attunement quest chain, and gotten your Drakefire Amulet?

Have you destroyed Onyxia in her lair and mounted her skull over your capital city gates?

How about going into Molten Core and seeing the majesty of Ragnaros? Or going into Blackwing Lair?

Have you ever gone into Zul’Gurub and seen the trolls, faced down some of those freaky bosses, and tried to get your mages the Turtle polymorph spell?

Have you ever seen the inside of Ahn’Qiraj? Or Naxxramas before they change it (although this requires a bit of attunement… but then again… if you get attuned now for Naxx, will it carry over for when it gets re-released? Hmmm?)

If you are clearing Karazhan, you and your friends can do all of this.

So, have you?

Have you ever assembled your guild and gone off hunting a World Dragon?

Wait, what about even older content, done in a different way?

Many people, while leveling, skip older instances with bad reputations, like Gnomeregan.

Did you know that MANY of the Pre-BC instances can be done as 10 man raids?

Check this link to WoWwiki, in the “Players Advised (Max)” column the number in paranthesis is the maximum number of players that can enter an instance. Check out how many say ’10’.

Seriously. You cannot complete instance quests while in a 10 man raid, but you can enter and kill and loot.

Have you ever taken 10 people to zerg Deadmines or Gnomer?

It’s something to think about…. if you’re bored, have you really used up ALL the fun in the game? And if you have mastered it all, then have all your friends? There is a joy to be had in seeing old content through the eyes of a friend who has never been there before… adn you could be helping guide the way.

Right now, Sidhe Devils is having fun doing all the things necessary for Onyxia attunement.

We’re going to go in and get us a dragon!

A lot of us have now got UBRS keys, and we did an UBRS run Saturday morning.

It’s been over a year and a half since I’ve been in there, and it was a lot of fun.

And helping Cassie and Elystia complete the Marshall Windsor escort, and then watching over Cassie’s shoulder as she did the slow march through Stormwind was awesome.

Elystia and Cassie turned it in together, and as they followed Windsor through the streets of Stormwind, they drew a crowd of followers, JUST like in the old Pre-BC days.

And even better, when the… event… at the top of Stormwind Keep began, people up there queued for PVP joined in the fighting, just like old times. But now, people don’t get one shot by those big bad guys. And Cassie took a few down by herself and got to loot them.

Sometimes, it can be hard to remember that, before Burning Crusade, UBRS was the last instance most guilds could see, unless they were part of a 40 man raiding guild.  UBRS was the Karazhan of the old world, a 10 man instance to gear folks up to face Onyxia and Zul’Gurub.

When BC came out, we leveled frantically to 70 in order to finally see something NEW that we could do with friends.

Many people got VERY tired of UBRS in the old days, ran it 20 or 200 too many times to get people Ony attuned. 

But it’s been a long time, and you are no longer level 60.

Why not see what it’s like?

And hey… when you zerg Gnomeregan as a 10 man raid, make sure and say Hi to Mekgineer Thermaplugg for me!

Oh, and if you take a 10 man group of Mages into Gnomer, make sure you film it… I’d like to see the overlapping explosions.


22 thoughts on “Are you really bored?

  1. I actually managed to solo Gnomeregan on my boomkin pre-BC, just because I was bored and he hadn’t been there before. And no, I didn’t moonfire spam. Been trying to get together with some people on my feral druid to do UBRS for the Onyxia attunement…

    What I’d especially like to see filmed is 10 mages in Gnomer vs an arcane nullifier and wiping from their own reflected damage.


  2. I actualy tried (several times) to get a few low level raids going. I think I even posted about it. Might have just been in my guild forums though, I can’t recall.

    I would love to get people to roll alts (or grab the long suffering bank toons) and go run something you can just barely get into. Think of a ten man raid of level ten characters trying to do Deadmines or Wailing Caverns.

    You want new raid content there it is.

    I think it would be a hoot, well worth rolling an alt and taking the couple hours to get to level 10.


  3. great ideas. i bet there are a lot of 70s out today who haven’t explored all the old-world content, and a lot of it will probably be a lot easier, particularly for those who are kara-geared.


  4. Being an entirely post-BC player, I’ve not seen big chunks of the “old” content…

    I went to Dire Maul for the first time the other day to help out a ‘lock guildie get his pony – we didn’t manage to get a healer, though, so it ended up with just my Feral Druid and Mr Demonology ‘lock.

    Ran out of time to complete the pony trick, but we’ll be back… It was fun, though…

    That did make me think a lot about the 5 or 10 man things I’ve not done at all in the “old” world – SFK, BRD, LBRS, UBRS, Strath, Scholo, Mara, RFD… It would be nice to go back into that, even solo to see it!


  5. Just throwing this out there: Didn’t Blizzard say they would be removing attunements for all previous Raids prior to the release of “Wrath?”


  6. So true! Just last night I stayed up until midnight to finish the Ony attunement for myself and another guild mate. It was me, a feral druid, and he, a fire mage. We did most of the quest up until you have to kill the general. We had trouble with the first room of UBRS and the summoners, so we brought along a priest friend of mine, then we got to the last room where the General is and started having trouble with the trash in there, so we brought my husband (a warrior). After that things went smooth as silk.

    Through the whole thing I kept thinking, “Wow, what a pain this would have been at 60.”


  7. It can be really fun to go and do things that you’ve already done, but doing things you haven’t done yet (in pre-BC) is even MORE fun! We stayed up most of Friday night clearing Naxxramus and killed Kel’thuzad (yay server first, lol) on Saturday night. After which we went and downed C’Thun in AQ 40.

    I never even got INTO either of those instances at 60, so it was quite fun to see it all.


  8. H Uldaman Server has been running weekly old-school content. We just took down Ragnaros this last Wednesday. We are working on attunement for Onyxia for most of our members and other various old world activities (including a blacksmith in guild working on Thunderfury) as well as our normal ZA and Kara schedule. We find that these old world raids are very helpful in training up our 60’s for what raiding is like so that when they get to Kara and ZA, they are less in the dark and more able to know what to expect. We also still require members to be keyed (for the most part) for Kara or to be working on Kara keys, as a way to show that they are serious about raiding and are geared as well as can be for their first Kara. We are a casual raiding guild, but we take our limited raiding time very seriously.

    These raids are fun, light hearted (because with so many 70’s we are OP), and very interesting to experience. I encourage people who are interested in raiding to try these out.

    H Uldaman Server


  9. Honestly, I don’t know why people hate Gnomer so much. It’s one of my favorite low-level instances, along with Maraudon and the Dire Maul wings. Of course, they’re all hellishly long compared to stuff like SM, ZF and Scholo, which everyone runs pretty much to death still.

    Amusing Gnomer experience, from back before they nerfed the Dark Iron Dwarves’ Landmines, and Thermaplugg’s bombs. Back in the day, some level 60 guildies (who were not really familiar with the instance) offered to help me complete Gnomer on an alt to get some of the quests there done. (Triprunner Dungerees. Awesome quest loot.) It was a pretty strange experience being in a lowbie instance with 3 level 60’s, and still being the only person there who knew their way around it.

    Eventually we reached the final approach ramps to Thermaplugg, and I remember trying to warn them about the landmines, and how they have to make sure they get them before they go boom.

    Being level 60, however, they must have felt that they were invincible in an instance that was only level 35, and ignored my advice.

    3 landmines later, we wiped. I did try and shoot them as they dropped, but when there’s 4 or 5 on the ground at once, there’s only so much a level 29 hunter can really do about it by herself.


  10. Maybe that’s the solution to the midlevel content, BBB; a social fix, rather than a Blizzard-side one. I still think it’s lazy on their part to consign the midlevel content and the “world” to a place to level for the endgame, but even that is a social phenomena, what with all the players trolling around at level 70, running the raid treadmill for pretty purple pixels. Yes, Blizzard encourages that in several ways, and could encourage exploration and midlevel play better… but it’s wrong of me to lay the blame completely on their shoulders.

    (Though making the next expansion along the lines of your Dragonflight midlevel alternate viewpoint concept would still be a fantastic idea. Grinding to and through the endgame gets pretty mindless after a few iterations.)


  11. Thanks for the suggestions, yes it can be a lot of fun. I went on a romp to kill an old world dragon, and it was crazy and wild – nice change of pace. Sometimes tho, it feels just a little passive and I’d rather roll an alt in preparation for wrath, than mess around in those complicated lvl 60 instances. Thats just me tho. Helping out your lower level friends can be a lot of fun also – gives you more of a solid motive.

    As an aside, I’m also very happy more players will be able to see all storyline content in Wrath. There’s too big a gap between Kara + 25 mans, and many guilds struggle to make the leap. I was getting bored with kara, so I moved to a bigger guild – making it harder for the guild I left behind. I hope the 10 man versions go a long way towards solving this issue for many of us.


  12. I was lurking in LFG the other day and someone was looking for a tank for Onyxia. I haven’t downed her since… Well… Pre-BC. We’ve tried a few times since but we didn’t have enough ranged DPS to get through phase two. So I signed up and we 5 manned (3 of whom were in the same guild) her – killed her on the third attempt (deep breath is still nasty). It was a lot of fun and when a PuG Karazhan run that had 3 members of that same guild was looking for a tank a couple days later… I signed up – because I had so much fun with their guild mates.

    There is a significant gear gap between Karazhan and ZA and numbers gap between Karazhan and 25 man raids. My small guild is really looking forward to WotLK so we can stay small and still move on past the first raid instance.


  13. My entire guild was built around the idea the all the Wrath raids will be 10mannable. There are 10 people in the guild and I’m leaving it that way. It makes it a lot easier to manage when there are but a few people, and it’s easier to design the guild so that everyone goes to every run always. Unless real life calls, of course. Pugging with this setup isn’t very hard either.


  14. I have been there and done that. I raided before BC. Not bragging, just setting up to follow…. I did it for loot. I hated it. I never said to myself… “Self… MC rocks just because it rocks.” It was fun for new content. It was fun to see the bosses in ZG. It was fun to play in AQ. It was fun to even attempt BWL. That was all.

    Having said that, I can honestly say Kara is a blast. ZA is a blast. My guild is made of mostly people that are just in the game for fun. There are maybe 20 of us, MAX, that have any inclination to raid. We do Kara weekly. We have recently added ZA to the mix. However, we just do not have the manpower to try anything more. We are not really a raid guild. We are geared… but we are there just to have fun.

    I greatly look forward to LK, hoping that it will offer many more Kara experiences.

    Currently we have an OSN (Old School Night) set up just to do old content. We have a slow growing group of people we are moving through this stuff. Lots of fun BBB, great post.


  15. yep i loved the old school stuff. i’ve played Wow sincei joined the EU Final Beta and then from day 1 so i’ve done most of the levelling instances although not all – and i’m someone who went to Gnomegan once and never again !

    it seemed to me ‘more’ fun in those days as people we actively interested in doing most instances and some you had to for attunements for other places like MC or you needed to run them to get your class gear set like our druid Wildheart one !

    its funny but a couple of guildies who have only played since BC ended up with some people they know in MC at the weekend. they were not there for any reason other than they had not seen it.

    i’d still like to get together with people and hit Naax – i got attuned about 18 months ago but my raid guild folded and i then have not raided properly since. i’d also like to go back and visit Neffy again as well as Ony.

    and another guildie whose played since the start did suggest we spent a bit of time and just went to have a look around the likes of Strat / Scholo / DM etc

    had some really fun times doing guild runs in U and L BRS. UBRS for a time was a 15 man place wasn’t it ? Then reduced to 10 man? Or am i going nuts ?


  16. It’s kind of funny, my guild is a bunch or real life friends and we just got to the point where we have a five man worth of level 70s. We’ve been working on gearing up the 3 newer characters for kara. Last night decided to poke around in ZG, just for the hell of it. to keep it a bit challenging we decided we wouldn’t do any research on it (no boss notes, no walkthroughs). had a lot of fun, took down the bat and snake bosses.

    I think its a shame that with the gear gap that people don’t run any of this stuff anymore, it can be a lot of fun and its still “new” content for a lot of us.

    Great post and great blog.


  17. Firstly, nice blog site John. Been reading your posts at WoW insider for a while now. Keep up the good work.

    Moving on, our guild did a retro raid of Molten Core over the last couple days and cleared the place tonight. We did so with around 10 people over each night, generally in Kara level gear. It was good seeing what all the fuss was all about – i never got the chance to see the old world raid instances as i did not hit 60 till just after BC.

    Its interesting seeing the various boss fights, story lines, quests and how little things have changed, such as Blizzard’s improved armor and weapon design, improved itemization for classes and specs (booo lack of feral gear in the old world) and improved handling of respawns.

    I also look forward to the forthcoming widespread introduction of 10 person raids in WotLK. I saw my brothers and friends guild collapse under the weight of raiding Molten Core – and many did not come back for the expansion after that. The 10 person format is just so much better for small guilds like ours which are more casual oriented. They are easier to organise and coordinate, let you see more of the end game, and you get to know better the people you raid with.

    Ashendar – Bloodscalp


  18. I picked up City of Heroes last week on a whim. A buddy of mine has played for 3 years or so and has been bugging me to try it. I’ve played WoW since OB and am getting a little weary with Kara/ZA/SSC, and don’t feel much like getting my rogue from 67 to 70 to run the same content.

    CoH is actually a lot of fun and a different than I expected. It’s sort of a super hero game, but mostly it’s a design whatever the heck you want and blow stuff up big time right out of the gate. And the community is really nice so far. Plus you can actually get a group for things without waiting an hour and group makeup isn’t as critical as it is in WoW.

    I went ahead and bought the box (and a new video card) after doing my first level 2 Sewer team. Fire/Fire ftw!


  19. I’m a newbie player (67.5 Warlock in about 3 months of playing, and two alts in the 20s) and have limited instance runs under my belt – Ragefire (twice), Wailing Caverns, Razorfen Kraul, Zul’Farak, SM Library, Hellfire Ramparts, and Blood Furnace. My wife, daughter (Hunter), and I tried to 3 man Sunken Temple as 54s and were PWNed due to lack of healing.

    I would like to do two^H^H^H three ^H^H^H^H^H among the things I’d like to do before WotLK are:
    – ding 70. Likely to happen, as my (casual) guild is helping to get my wife (Warrior) leveled ASAP to start Kara raiding.
    – get a bear mount. Not likely to happen, am I’m not qualified by time or temperment to be in a serious raiding guild. Don’t know if I’ll have time to gear up. Although there is a group doing runs on our server for 10K gold…..
    – see Nax and Onyxia in their original splendor.

    I’ve seen some discussion on our server’s forum about old-world raids and there is an Alliance player (I’m “For the Horde!”) trying to up for PUG runs. One I ding 70, maybe I’ll try to do the same for Horde…..


  20. Honestly, I think most people want at least *something* for doing things in older WoW content. That’s the reason I think achievements will make guilds want to go back and try old content.

    At the moment people have heard about achievements, but don’t know how retroactive they are in terms of instances right now.


  21. Not on this toon, but I definitely have screenshots of my first Ragnaros, Onyxia, Nefarian, C’thun, and Patchwerk kills on my old character (which I sold). ^^;

    You’re right – old-world content is a blast, and more guilds should think about doing it for fun. 🙂


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