Wherein I enrage the Star Wars fans

We be back from vacation!

We went to the Dells in Wisconsin, a fun filled land where, apparently by state law, every hotel must have it’s own water park.

There are plenty of stories that could be told, but there is something I really want to talk about first. Hot button was hit, and hit hard.

On Saturday, we took our son Alex to see a movie, as kind of a cool-down after tons of water filled adventure, time in the sun, and mini-golf up one side of a mountain and down the other (I whole-heartedly recommend the Pirate Adventure Golf, by the way, well maintained courses, 5 different 18 hole mini-golf courses of varying difficulty… just well done).

There is a movie theater in the Dells, and imagine my surprise to learn that this new Star Wars I’ve been hearing about was an actual movie released in theaters. I figured it would be more Cartoon Network TV episodes.

Go figure.

Cassie checked it out to see if it was supposed to be appropriate for a 5 year old, and said it looked okay. So off we went Saturday to see Star Wars; the Clone Wars.

I am sure that it is going to surprise no one when I say that I want to punch George Lucas and his writers right square in the mouth.

Just, what a bunch of asshats for writing that and directing it.

I could go back and forth on it’s merits as a stand alone movie. As a movie, it wasn’t too bad. It certainly wasn’t good, but it wasn’t too bad.

It was way too long, it had too many mindless fighting and spaceship shooting sequences, scenes that were just filler… like they needed to take an hour of plot and stretch it out to a full length movie, so someone said ‘if we drag out the lightsaber fights, blaster fights and spaceships in combat, it’ll be more exciting and action packed’.

Almost as if someone read a complaint that a previous movie or TV show was heavy on dialogue and light on action, so they decided to make sure the ‘lots of action’ achievement got punched up.

Fine, that’s okay. It gave me the opportunity to close my eyes and chill a few times, since the action without plot was just boring.

But other than that, it was okay as a movie. The plot wasn’t very imaginative, it wasn’t very creative, but it was certainly a good movie for 5 year olds. If that was the target audience, okay, good job. Still too long, but that’s okay, special effects animators need to eat too.

No, my problem comes from the whole damn concept of this film.

Warning, spoilers of the Star Wars: The Clone Wars movie plot setup follow.






Okay, you were warned.

Since we are talking Star Wars, and you are reading this, I am going to assume that you have seen the Star Wars Episode III movie, where we finally see Hayden/Anakin go baaaad.

We see the birth of Darth Vader, and his final descent to the dark side.

Okay, so Episode III was pretty poorly written. I mean, seriously… it sucked. The writing, just…. come on. This was the best you could come up with?

But okay, it is what it is.

The way they wrote it, Anakin goes to the Jedi Temple in Episode III, and he kills all the kids. All the young jedi. The younglings. The kids and, we infer, the infants and everyone else in the building.

He, Anakin, personally slaughters every kid in the place. That is what the scene in Episiode III infers, and thankfully, I didn’t have to watch it in graphic detail.

For myself, it didn’t really seem to me that anything we had seen in any film prior to that was in any way a justification for him doing that.

No, I’m not saying there would be a justification for it in the real world, but in the world of this movie, they are trying to sell us on the idea that Anakin was led down the path to the dark side by the Emperor, but that he was blind to what was going on until he finally cracked with the death of his wife.

Umm…. but he has no problem killing a bunch of kids because the Emperor tells him to?

It was at that point, to me, the entire series jumped the shark. Not the wailing cry of Darth Vader at the end, no, that didn’t bother me. No, for me it was the scene where we are led to believe that killing all those kids was just the first baby step towards thinking about being evil, and not even really a full step on the path of evil at all.

Sorry, in my opinion, that WAS him becoming truly and utterly evil. There should have been no chance in any way that he was anything other than totally committed to evil before he stepped foot in that temple.

And the whole scene was over the line, anyway. It didn’t need to be there.

But that’s how they did it. that’s how they wrote it, and filmed it, and one would think they gave very careful thought to it before doing it.

Fine. I thought it made for a crappy scene that ruined the rest of the movie for me, but hey, whatever.

But now… oh, but now. They did the Cartoon Network series, and now they did the Clone Wars movie.

And all of this crap takes place after Episode II and before Episode III.

We saw Episode III. We know that Anakin Skywalker is a childkiller, a worthless little whiny sack of shit that murdered a room full of kids in cold blood.

So why write more movies showing Anakin to be a hero with personal spiritual growth?

That’s what you wrote, that’s what you did. You could have written it so he became a ‘black knight’, a warrior of darkness that hunted down the Jedi to avenge his twisted feelings of betrayal, WITHOUT having him kill a room full of kids in cold blood. It was unneccesary to the story. He could have been evil, but still had a personal code of honor. Lawful evil, not chaotic evil, if you will.

But fine, it was done. Your writers suck, we laughed at you and moved on.

However, you persist in wanting to milk the Star Wars franchise.

So we get this film… which takes place before Episode III, and stars Anakin and Obi-Wan together as buddy cops. It’s a buddy cop film, and then (spoiler), Anakin gets his own Padawan apprentice. A cute little girl youngling, for him to teach.

Now, I think it’s safe to say that she’s not going to make it to Episode III. Anyone remember a Padawan of Anakin’s being mentioned in Episode III? No?

Well, they must plan on either more films after this one, or a TV series, because he’s got a cute little sidekick in this film.

That’s right. He gets a very young, cute female apprentice in the movie. And he resents her, and she is earnest as a puppy trying to be accepted, and in the end they both bond and learn from each other and they both grow in maturity and understanding and acceptance of new things and come to respect and trust each other.

Yes, Anakin learns a great deal from having a new apprentice, and takes some nice steps in personal growth and in becoming a good Jedi. Good guys win, everyone happy-happy.

The end.

Wait… so, what, Anakin’s a hero now? And everyone lives happily ever after? And he just had a big bonding experience with a youngling that he takes on as an apprentice?

Am I the only one here that remembers… Anakin is a worthless childkilling sack of shit?

Nothing, NOTHING in Clone Wars is worth watching when you know he is going to kill those kids.

He’s not the hero. He’s not a role model for our youth. He is not someone worthy of an action figure.

He’s a childkiller.

And continuing to show movies of him as the big courageous hero AFTER doing Episode III is morally bankrupt.

How the hell do you assume that your audience has seen all your Star Wars films and has seen Episiode III, and then continue writing this shit?

If you want to milk this franchise, then do the Clone Wars AFTER Episode III. Show Darth Vader as an evil bastard hunting down the Jedi, and the few remaining Jedi trying to save who they can.

Oh, wait, is that not fun? You can’t easily see how to write that so the kids will like it? Would it take effort and talent and skill to write that story? Can’t figure out how to make that a light and carefree summer film?

Then you shouldn’t have had Anakin slaughter a roomful of kids, should you, you stupid asshats!

Has no one got the balls to stand up to Lucas, and tell him that once you go down that road, you can’t pretend it’s all innocence and happiness and puppies?

This message has been brought to you by the association for movies that don’t star childkillers as the hero, and by the letter ‘y’.


40 thoughts on “Wherein I enrage the Star Wars fans

  1. (Spoilers this post.)

    So everything besides the original trilogy (4-6) sucks in movie format. What else is new?

    Seriously, if this is your first experience with the Star Wars universe, I’m very sad that you started with the Clone Wars. It was very flashy, with a grand total of three redeeming scenes – or, really, two quotes and a scene. First, “Sith lords are our speceality.” The British accent made that an amazing quote, even if I can’t spell it properly. Secondly, “Not to worry – we are still flying *half* a ship.” Again, British accent.

    The scene was one of the final in the movie – Yoda vs Dooku. (…Wait, I can’t have this right. The quotes must be from the next movie, because Dooku died right after them.) Taken in the context of all the rest of the movie, that fight scene wasn’t too awesome, but on its own, it – I say – shines.

    So there you have it, one entire scene worth watching from the fifth movie. (Chronologically. The original trilogy was awesome enough that it still lays claim to the titles of “movies one through three”.) The sixth… I skipped every scene involving only Anakin and Padme. It was just horrible. The fourth… Darth Maul was pretty cool, don’t get me wrong, but just don’t get me started on it.

    What I really recommend is, if you haven’t already, watch the original trilogy (avoid the remastered version of Return of the Jedi if you can – there’s one scene that got slightly modified due to what happened in the second trilogy, and it’s worse off for it) and read the books. The Young Jedi Knights series was kinda cool, but it was really geared towards kids around 12 years old (which, come to think of it, was the last time I read one of those books). Timothy Zhan, however, is an amazing writer, and I’m proud to share his first name. I’m just trying to remember where his books fit into the Star Wars timeline…

    I can do some research and get back to you after work, if you’d like.


  2. I haven’t been taking this movie seriously so I didn’t mind reading the second section of your post. Thank you for reaffirming my gut instict to not make this movie a priority.

    However, this weekend I had the chance to catch G4’s special on the annual Star Wars festival thingy in Tokyo. During the show, they talked a little bit about this current film. Anakin’s sidekick will have a main role in the upcoming live-action series that Lucas is working on.

    My understanding is that this series will center on this sidekick and her generation of Jedi. Anakin will not show up in the series at all because, this from Lucas himself “…his story has already been told.”

    I’m cautiously excited about the potential for the TV series. Paraphrasing more of what Lucas said in his interview with G4, it’ll give them a chance to delve into another corner of the Star Wars story and that could be fun.


  3. I’m not talking about Episode II, Armond, I’m talking about the brand new animated Clone Wars movie that just came out in theaters for the first time this weekend.

    That’s why I’m irritated about it.

    I had my issues with the quality of writing before, but that was okay. There was a lot I liked from Episode II.

    No, my problem now is, anything they write or create after Episode III, has to be done with an awareness that we know what Anakin DOES in Episode III. And they seem to really wish Episode III never happened now, since they want Anakin to be the big hero.

    It was interesting to watch the first two prequels, knowing that we were watching the transformation of Anakin into Darth Vader.

    It’s funny… I was able to enjoy the character of Darth Vader when he possessed a certain nefarious, dark majesty, a black knight quality to him.

    From the description we had been given, I could have envisioned him as being on the dark side of the force, but having ‘hunted down the last of the jedi order’… as in, fighting and destroying, one on one or one on two or three, the last of the powerful jedi in personal combat.

    His going out to face the enemy (the rebels) personally in his own tie fighter in episode IV seemed to reinforce that image. He had minions, but he wanted to fight his own battles, and stand face to face against all who would oppose him.

    It made him a deluded figure that had fallen to the dark side, but you could imagine that he was once a great and honorable warrior, and you could believe that if only Luke could reach inside of him to the man he once was, he could be brought back to the light.

    Once I saw the child killing crap from Episode III, I no longer wanted Luke to redeem him, I wanted someone to stick a lightsaber up his… umm, I wanted someone to put him down like a rabid dog. Wierd.


  4. KhyBear, are you serious? This movie was supposed to be an introduction to the female apprentice as the star of a new live action series?


    How can it be a series about her generation of Jedi, when from the timeline I thought that there was only a year or two between the events of Episode II and Episode III?

    Hmmm, again. Well, IF they do take on a live action show without Anakin in it at all, I believe I will be delighted to see it. Especially if it starts with her grown up a teeny bit and seperated from Anakin as a Jedi in her own right. Her character was pretty cool.

    And, on the positive side, I do love the Clone Trooper Commandos.


  5. Agreed. That scene also had me angry at Padme and Obi Wan for those long, extended monologues afterwards where they were trying to talk sense to him. They knew what he’d done. The boy has obviously snapped. Now is the time for cracking him over the head and hauling him off unconscious, because the whole yelling plattitudes thing has apparently just sent him off the deep end.

    I was going to avoid this stinkbomb on principle alone, but now I have a better reason. Thanks. And apologies to the animators – the style looks like it might’ve been interesting if used on any other story.


  6. Zahn’s books are after the Return of the Jedi I believe.

    Not sure what the issue is here. Its not like its a surprise that at some point in the future Anakin become Darth Vader. Is this issue how or the order in which it was written? So The Phantom Menace (which sucked) shouldn’t have shown him as a little kid? You can’t watch it now because you know what the end result is? If I remember right, he killed a bunch of kids in Attack of the Clones as well. Does that ruin the beginning of Revenge of the Sith?

    I’m not sure I understand. The ‘timeline’, if you will, also has Anakin killing the Emperor and bringing balance to the Force. So at some point he ‘redeems’ himself.

    It seems like you’re picking a single point of reference (the jedi temple) and refusing to allow any oppportunity to see that character from any other point of reference (before OR after that incident). That would be a pretty boring story. Heck I’d like to think that my personal story is defined by more than just a drunken Okinawan bar brawl. Its not one of my most shining happy moments but I’d like to think there’s some things I did before AND after that would make for some interesting stories as well.

    I don’t have an issue with expanding the story in a way that opens up the Star Wars universe to a new generation of fans. That’s certainly the direction they seem to be taking. Its kidified cartoony stuff without a lot of depth. So what? I doubt your son had any issue with it. 😀


  7. Generation was a bad word to use.

    “Graduating Class” would have been better.

    After a little research though, it appears that the new TV series is going to be animated…I could have sworn that said “live action” on G4 the other day. Hopefully, I’ll be able to catch it again and see where I got it wrong.


  8. Rotoman, I have to admit, I don’t remember him killing children in Attack of the Clones. I only saw it once, so I might very well ahve missed it. If so, then I apologize for taking his killing children in the temple as being a single event… and I am truly sorry I watched the damn third movie, since that would have stopped it for me on Episode II.

    And I KNOW you didn’t mean it the way that sounded… because I’m sure you would agree that there is a big difference between a drunken bar fight in Okinawa, and killing a bunch of kids. You just mean that I should have some perspective, I think?

    I can see that, but YES, for me, once the main character slaughters a bunch of kids, yes, that pretty much is a deal breaker for my ever wanting to watch anything showing that character to be a hero.

    I’ll be more than happy to watch anything else in that universe you care to create, a series or movie starring the Clone Trooper Commandos would be awesome. And as I said, I’d be happy with a show that centered around Anakin’s Padawan.

    Just don’t do any more shows portraying Anakin as the main hero of the story, that’s all.

    The live action show they are doing, I had THOUGHT, wasn’t even going to have Jedi in it. I thought it was going to take place after Episode III, and was going to follow various normal folks during the time of the forming of the Rebel Alliance, leading up to the final events that kick off Episode IV. I would be excited to see all of that.

    I hope that, even if you totally disagree with me, you can at least understand where I’m coming from on this Anakin issue.


  9. Yep, I gotcha now. The sand people incident was what I was referring to.

    I was not by any means comparing a bar fight to killing kids. Where I was struggling with your argument was that you don’t like that they are protraying him post Episode III being written and viewed as a hero in a timeline before that incident happened. But you did state in one of your follow up posts that you imagined Darth being a hero at some point then falling from grace. Doesn’t seem to me to be an issue showing his previous commendable exploits. I think you’re stuggling with the ‘how’ that fall happened. I do as well. I wish that had been written better.

    Change of subject – have you taken the little guy to the Science Museum for the Star Wars exhibit? If not, I would recommend it and doing it on a Saturday. Only a few weeks left before it closes. On Saturday there’s several of us (yeah I’m one of those) in costume wondering the exhibit.


  10. “Anyone remember a Padawan of Anakin’s being mentioned in Episode III?”

    No, but then I don’t remember R2-D2 being able to fly in Eps 4-6, neither. For that matter, Obi-Wan couldn’t remember R2 at all. Memory loss seems to be a serious issue in these movies…

    Darth Vader, as originally presented, were a fuhggin’ awesome villian. Unfortunatelies, Lucas came up with this notion of presenting a fall from grace and a redemption, and from that point on everything went way, way downhill.


  11. Yeah, I’ve heard some disappointing things about Clone Wars… which makes me sad. Even if it is a cartoony Star Wars I was still kinda interested in it.

    I have just finished a Star Wars marathon with the boyfriend (all episodes from I-VI), gotta admit we both talked about it and decided that III actually wasn’t that bad. Not up to the original trilogy, but still, yaaaaards ahead of I and II.

    A New Hope is still my favorite, call me crazy =P


  12. We were going to take Alex to the Children’s Museum on Saturday, before we decided to head out to the Dells.

    We’re going to see friends on Friday night, and we’ve got an Onyxia raid saturday night (assuming my slacker guildies get attuned by then), but going to the Science Museum Saturday afternoon isn’t out of the question.


  13. I lied John. This is the last weekend for the exhibit. Saturday and Sunday we will have characters there from 9 – 5pm. I’ll be there Saturday in full stormtrooper get up.

    Call ahead for tickets. You’ll need to get a reservation. Bring your camera. If you have trouble with tix, email me. I have 4 I won’t be using. Its a great exhibit and one he’ll totally enjoy (as will you, trust me).


  14. I still love the original Trilogy, Pike… and I even love the Ewoks.

    Yes, yes, I know, I know… they were supposed to be Wookies in Return of the Jedi… and Lucas changed it to Ewoks for the appeal to the kids.

    I don’t care, I loved the bloodthirsty little Ewoks, I thought they were great.

    I liked the Ewoks wanting to eat Han, I liked the Ewok taking a joyride on the scooter, I liked the Ewoks taking over the walker, I liked the Ewoks looking up to Chewie as super-Ewok… I just liked the whole dang thing. If they hadn’t been wanting to eat the good guys, maybe I’d feel different, but somehow the fact that they looked cute but were really mean, vicious nasty little furballs redeemed them to me.

    And what could beat Admiral Ackbar’s most famous captain-obvious understatement quote of all time; “It’s a trap!”

    No, really?


  15. There’s no chance at all that I’ll watch the new animated movie, but I was wondering if anyone else had the same problem with the reason for Anakin’s turn to the dark side that I did.

    As I recall, the Emperor was able was able to to tempt Anakin with the offer of saving his wife’s life, because Anakin had been having dreams of her dying in childbirth.

    Dying in childbirth. In a civilization that has cloning, faster than light drive, incredibly advanced robotics, bionic limbs, and medical technology that can save a guy after he falls into and rolls around in lava.

    I mean, even now in our society women still die in childbirth, but it’s not at all common. If the Star Wars civilization has all that other stuff, wouldn’t childbirth be sort of a non-issue? I mean, you’d think that would get sorted out along the way.

    So Anakin was motivated by a fear of something he should have known just wasn’t a real possibility. Like people in modern day Oklahoma being motivated by fears of Comanche attacks.

    just stupid.


  16. Ok, horrible Star Wars geek moment.

    George Lucas should have stepped out after 6.

    Let the extended universe guys take over, it has a mostly consistent plot, and makes a lot of sense.

    Taking some spoilers, about 30 years after Episode 6 there is a huge alien invasion from beyond the Unknown Regions (a region the only alien grand-admiral in the Empire’s history, also a tactical / strategic genius, was set to guard / control). These aliens have very powerful technology and their ships are on par in terms of size with the super star destroyers+, they tend to transform worlds into shipyards and vongform (terra from to vong compatible worlds) places.

    As such the whole Emporer creating star destroyers, super star destroyers and such like starts to make a lot more sense, there needed to be a force in the galaxy capable of defending it (and indeed likely there would have been a much better response to the invasion under the Emperor’s control). The Death Star starts to look like a tool to destroy their shipyards if they make it through the initial push (Sun Crusher etc being used to literally destroy the initial entrance vector worlds).

    However standing in the way of this “evil” you have Jedi, and from the looks of it the fall of anakin skywalker really should have been a bad overlap between two different plans, the Emperor turns Anakin to the darkside in an effort to remove the Jedi Order to make it stronger, he needs force capable users who are willing to use anger, to attack and to destroy the vong, not simply to defend (which the new Jedi under Luke Skywalker are capable of, as they are less bound by tradition). The Emperor’s actions kind of bear this out, with his Hands, and other darkside force users being around at the time, not simply the 1 master 1 apprentice as usual.

    Yoda also appears to have this plan, you notice in the movies, despite being very prescient he essentially drives Anakin away from the Jedi, leaving his training in the hands of a new Jedi Knight, he doesn’t stop him being emo around the Emperor. It looks like Yoda was attempting to destroy (though possibly not quite so effectively) or restructure the Jedi order for the coming conflict. His death on Dagobah fits in nicely with this, he teaches Luke the basics of being a Jedi, gives him the tools he needs to become a light side user, but not bound to the traditions, when Luke presses him for more, to become a real Jedi and to follow the traditions, Yoda dies suddenly (Suicide?).

    All in all the plot looks like it was setup to sacrifice Anakin to ensure that the Jedi order survived and met the incoming invasion, the Emperor while evil appears to have started on that route as the basis of good and keeping Humanity alive, even his distrust of Aliens makes sense in this context due to the limit of prescience (he may not know which aliens are invading, simply that failure to stop the invasion will result in a massive destruction of life, meaning he must rely on Humans as the primary force).

    Then Lucas went and wrote some stuff…

    … and added Haydenn “I can’t smile” Christian to the end of the 6th movie rather than old anakin, which annoyed me to no end seeing as it was the old anakin that repented, not the young hot head.

    Anyway, in short, 4-6, good movies, traditional sci-fi fairy tale. Extended universe good, Lucas…


  17. If I remember correctly, at least based on APPEARANCE, if you watch the Clone Wars TV show (animated, two seasons), the little padawan apprentice in there is actually a jedi knight in her own right and dies (off screen, but highly presumed) fighting General Grievous, along with an Ithorian jedi, trying to keep Grievous from kidnapping the Emperor.

    Open Episode III.

    Since her death wasn’t actually SHOWN, I hope just like Yoda, Ben and Mara Jade, she’s one of those jedi that actually survived somehow and was in hiding.

    It is, after all, what countless text-based role playing games of the early 90’s were all about. A lone jedi hiding somewhere and people in the game finding him and learning to become jedi, while other players are either imperial or rebellion.

    Ah, fun times. 🙂


  18. BBB, take your kid to the Science Museum exhibit for sure. My wife and I took her sister (she’s 9) and she had a total blast.

    The best part is it’s not just for kids…they have the real models they used for the original trilogy on display there. So you can go have your picture taken…with THE. REAL. MILLENIUM. FALCON. It’s the coolest fucking thing in the world. I’m 25 now and saw Star Wars for the first time when I was your son’s age, and standing there in St. Paul and looking at the actual models of the TIE Fighter, X Wing, Star Destroyer, etc. that were filmed for the original movies that I idolized so much as a kid (I was and am a HUGE Star Wars geek) was completely indescribable…you absolutely cannot miss it because it’s just an amazing feeling.


  19. Its a very ‘hands on’ exhibit as well. You can build a robot, a mag lev train, design a jawa village. There’s plenty of cool things to do as well as seen within the exhibit.


  20. Ewwww, Pidge.

    Just… ewwwww.

    Much happier to see the scruffy looking nerf herder get the girl.

    Errr, Princess, I mean.


  21. Thanks for the heads up, BBB.

    And, since the EU has been mentioned, I’ll just say that I thought the Vong were utter garbage. “Darker, edgier, grittier” does not equal better. The most recent novels just seem to be a retread of the Vader mythos via a new generation. Killing fan favorite characters is the new black. And, y’know… Vader was completely stupid, a brain-dead, short sighted fool. Why revisit that sort of inanity?

    The EU was going well before Vector Prime. I don’t begrudge Salvatore, since I like some of his other books, but the guys behind the arcs introduced in VP are high on my “stupid gits” list.


  22. I took my kids to see it yesterday and I thought it was fine. I was pretty down on the whole project from the fist time I heard that it was going to make it to the big screen. I had pretty low expectations. That is probably why it was “okay”.

    This movie is supposed to be a launching point for the new Star Wars Animated Series on Cartoon Network. It was designed to introduce you to Anakin’s Padawan and acclimate you to the animation style.

    The problem that I had with the movie was the audience it targeted: young boys ages 5-8? There were a lot of really cutsie things in there (Jabba’s Son?) which fit in fine with his target audience. The problem is that they also introduced the Padawan, Ahsoka. As the movie progresses, Anakin becomes more attached to his Padawan. By the end of the TV series, I am sure he will have quite an affection for her. I am sure most of the viewers will to. But she doesn’t make it to Episode III. Her death is probably one more step towards the Dark Side for Anakin….but how do you address that if your target audience is 5?

    I grew up with Star Wars. The first movie came out when I was an impressionable 8 years old…there was nothing that remotely compared to it at the time. The prequels were not created for me but for my kids, who turned 10 yesterday. I can say a lot of bad things about the prequels, but the fact that my kids love them, and Star Wars as a whole, goes a long way towards allowing me to accept them.


  23. For that matter, Obi-Wan couldn’t remember R2 at all.

    IIRC, he said he couldn’t remember owning such a droid.

    There is someone that retconned all the inconsistent points among the two trilogies and has a Yoda-led conspiracy to rebalance the force with Chewbacca and R2 as the two “field agents” pusing things along.


  24. @ Fulcran et al,

    If you watch the video I linked above, the Fan Relations rep from LucasFilms clearly states that they have no idea what happened to Ahsoka as far as her death is concerned.

    And according to Lucas’ own statement that Anankin’s story has already been told and he won’t be a factor in the upcoming series I don’t see how he can become “more attached” to his Padawan by the end of the series.

    Is there an official source somewhere refuting these points? If so, please let me know so I can stop spouting off erroneous info. 🙂


  25. Collectively, the entire plot arc of all six movies is about the rise, fall and redemption of Anakin Skywalker. We already know that Anakin is an utterly evil killer in Episode IV. The prequels are simply the story of how a good man was corrupted by his own emotions (love leads to fear, which leads to hate and anger). The temple scene is important because Anakin willingly sacrifices his own humanity for the sake of Padmé. When he later loses Padmé (“Nooooooo!”), any remaining shreds of humanity left in him are seemingly lost. His eventual redemption when he casts aside the Emperor for the love of his son show that we wasn’t completely lost. The same good that we see in the boy in Episodes I and II still exists within the evil monster that became Darth Vader. It’s OK to show Anakin as a hero figure pre-corruption because it makes the story of his tragic fall that much more poignant.


  26. You said it for me, BBB. That scene where he slaughters the kids just trashed the second Star Wars trio. It was already mediocre in every way, a big budget epic snooze fest. And then slaughter of the innocents made Vader unredeemable, despite the very last scene of Return of the Jedi.

    It’s always bugged me.

    Another thing that bugs me about the second trio: “prequel”. There’s a great idea: tell us some stuff we already know. Boring. The same goes for Star Trek: prequel suckage syndrome. The Enterprise series was mediocre; no one wants to see a struggling and building Federation after seeing it in all it’s glory. And now, they’re remaking the first series.

    Big mistake.


  27. I saw the Clone Wars movie on Friday, and as a Star Wars fan, I thought it was ok. I understand that it was made for kids, it’s a series on Cartoon Network. Lucas liked the series so much he told them make a feature length episode err movie to start it off with.

    Anakin was one of the most annoying kids in a movie ever in Episode 1.
    Anakin was an emo whiny bitch with a chip on his shoulder in Episode 2.
    Anakin was actually really appealing in the Clone Wars 2 seaons cartoon on Cartoon Network (done by Genndy Tartakovsky, which this new movie and series uses his character designs but rendered in 3D CG).
    Anakin was finally a somewhat decent Jedi, but much too hot headed in the first half of Episode 3, then takes the plunge into evil. I’m sorry, but if Lucas had emo Episode 2 Anakin throughout 3, I would’ve bought his sudden snap with Mace and the temple part just after a lot easier.

    I think the reason he keeps showing Anakin as a hero is to try to further impact how much a fall he took. But, my biggest problem with the new trilogy is that Lucas can’t direct. He’s good with story, he sucks with dialog and direction.


  28. My only real issue with the prequels is that they were poorly told. In the interest of recruiting a new generation of fans, they completely sacrificed the story, that potentially could have been among the greatest cinema.

    If they would have made Episode II a story about his virtue, his unwaivering devotion to the Jedi and its principles (if perhaps a little reckless), then Episode III would have been much better (although that movie suffers enough by itself). So, in my mind, Episode II SHOULD have been what this new movie apparently is, a view of Anakin as the young hero, before he begins to fall to the dark side of the force. The fact that he already begins descending pretty much from the beginning of Episode II, kind of makes any portrayal of Anakin as a would-be hero weak at this point.


  29. @ech: You refer to http://www.morningstar.nildram.co.uk/A_New_Sith.html. Would that Lucas were actually the creative.

    I like the new movie– for what it was. But I see BBB’s point. Some acts put you beyond redemption. If slaughtering children who trust you as a protector doesn’t fall in that category, I don’t know what does.

    I could easily come up with real world examples of redeemable vs unredeemable people from the same side of a war… but even one violation of Godwin’s Law will violate the terms of my parole.


  30. Why not do what we all want and do movies or series, live action or animated, picking up after the 6th in the series showing what happens to Luke and Leia/Solo offspring.

    Anything else at this point makes no sense.

    I totally approve of BBB’s original message. Glad i have not gone to see the latest film… I was pretty sure looking at a little Jabba burp wasn’t going to do it for me.


  31. Reading this rant you have about the Star Wars Clone Wars movie brought back to mind when I went to watch Episode III in a movie theatre. The scene where he goes an kills the Jedi in the temple had played at and in the row in front of me this kid is sniffling and whimpering. His dad looks over and asks “What’s wrong?” Which the kid says “Anakin, dad he is killing everyone!” Which the father says, “Well duh he’s Darth Vader”…….


  32. I never saw Episode III….almost walked out on Epi II. None of the last 3 (4 counting this movie) should have been made.

    It turns out that Willow wasn’t an abberation…it was just signs of things to come. And Willow was better than any of the new Star Wars movies…which makes me very sad.


  33. Hey, I liked Willow!

    Okay, I liked Mad Martigan. I could’ve done without that little know it all Willow bastard.


  34. I loved every star wars movie. I love every star wars video game. I have star wars Mr Potatoheads on my desk as I am writing this. Darth Tater is my favorite.

    Yes epis I-III had their problems. The writers not only had to invent histories for most of the figures in the first series, but also incorporate many of the cannonical references from the star wars ‘universe.’

    Someone mentioned wanting to know the story after epi VI. There’s alot of books concerning Han & Leia’s kids (Jaina and Jacen [twins], and Anakin, named for his grandfather, who Leia grew to admire, dispite the horrible things he did). Luke and Mara Jade had a son, Ben.

    As for killing the younglings. The master/apprentice system that they used dictated that the apprentice does whatever the master tells them. Anakin didn’t just decide to go over there and start killing babies. His master commanded him to. This was the way things were done. (esp if you didn’t wanna get fried by a Sith lord’s force lightning). This just shows what an amazing feat it was at the end of ROTJ for Vader to turn on his master and ulitmately kill him, while at the same time giving his own life for the life of his son.

    I agree they didn’t have to explicitly state that he was about to slaughter children, but it made everyone in the theater go OH MY GOD HOW COULD HE…..thus gluing their eyes to the screen for the rest of the film.

    And a side note — Boba Fett survived the Sarlaac pit and lived for another like 50 years. Didn’t see that one coming.


  35. Oh yeah, BBB- If you like the clone trooper aspect you should check out the republic commando books/game. They’re like a SEAL team of elite clonetroopers. Very good reads.


  36. Star Wars (IV) Great; Empire Strikes Back (V) Awesome;
    Everything Else…crap…period

    Star Wars was the first great Scifi story put to film (or tv), The books/stories that are out are generally very good. But the movies themselves (after the first 2 releases)? it’s a shame that Lucas found the anti-philosopher stone and manage to turn gold to lead.

    Sorry Star Trek fans but Trek never really had anything approaching a real, comprehensive storyline.

    From a writing and plot standpoint neither holds a candle to Babylon 5 or Firefly…

    I haven’t really watched the new Battlestar, so I can’t comment there



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